Joyluck - I loved taking my great niece to the dollar store and giving her a few dollars to spend. To watch her and her decision making process on how to spend the money was as much fun as anything she purchased.
Very timely: Yesterday I finished listening to a book on CD in the car and I switched on the radio. The program was called The Splendid Table. The host covered several topics but first was an interview with Tracie McMillan. Her book, The American Way of Eating; Undercover at Walmart, Applebee's, Farm Fields, and the Dinner Table, sounds very interesting and timely. She spent a year working undercover in farm fields and other menial jobs. She mentioned in the interview her job in the fields was harvesting garlic. She was paid $1.60 for every 5 gallon bucket of garlic. Technically, the employer is supposed to bring the wage up to minimum if the worker is unable to make that harvesting the product. Unfortunately, most of the workers in the fields are undocumented so they don't complain and the employer gets by paying less than minimum wage.
But the real take away was the last question and comment from the interview:
For a year you were working essentially undercover. Is there one picture that comes to your mind when you look back at that time?
TMM: The main picture that would come up for me is a kitchen with empty cupboards. I really just didn't have enough money to buy pantry staples, condiments and all these fancy things. In my normal life I forget what a luxury it is to have a well-stocked pantry. It's very easy to cook quickly and well when you have a few different vinegars, a couple different oils, a panoply of spices. That makes it really easy to cook something delicious very quickly. It's really not as much fun to cook when you're stuck with salt, pepper, oregano, rice and beans.
Yes, there is a problem of hunger in this country as well as all over the world. I grew up middle class, happy, healthy, living in apartments most of my life. We (my culture) believed education was very important. A person doesn't have to settle for minimum wage jobs a lifetime. Get training, a skill and get off the welfare merry go round. My grandparents were immigrants and came to this country with nothing. I never got free breakfast, lunch, dinner or even a free turkey. Stop having babies at age 17 and get an education. If you are on welfare, stop getting your nails done and lose all the tattoos. (I overheard a co-worker complaining to another co-worker that they reduced her welfare). I was Shocked!!! This woman was an able-bodied 35 y.o. She got her nails done regularly & had tattoos. Get off welfare and pay your own way. (I don't mind tattoos, my DD loves them, but they are Expensive!) There is a lot of abuse with all the gov't programs. Welfare & Unemployment offer Free training/education. Take advantage of it and dont settle for minimum wage jobs......
No one has to settle for a minimum wage job... IF they don't want to. Education IS available for those that have the initiative to go out and get it. (And by the way, "undocumented" = illegal which ='s against the law!) If you can sit home and drink beer all day while watching the latest episode of that Jerry Springer loser of a show, then you can get your *** up and out to find a job.
I'm sick and tired of hearing about these people that can't do anything but stand on a street corner and beg. Like Micheal Jordan says... "If you can ask 'hey buddy can you spare a dollar', you can say "welcome to McD's, can I take your order".
We are always going to have to deal with the homeless and the disabled, and we SHOULD take care of those that can't take care of themselves. But now we're stuck in a cycle where it is more advantageous for a certain party to have dependents because dependents ARE DEPENDENT ON THE GOVERNMENT FOR EVERYTHING and they will always vote them in... lining the pockets of those that believe in dependency as a way of life. If that type of go v ern ment works so well, why do we have so many more dependents than ever... because dependency does not improve the life of anyone.
People are having babies out of wedlock simply because it enables them to collect more welfare checks, and don't tell me they don't, they do, I've worked many years in many ER's around the country and this is the case. When a 26 year old is having her 8th baby, there's something drastically wrong.
Education is the answer, our country cannot keep up this spending, each child born today owes more than 200,000.00 to the go vern ment the day he/she is born.
My husband is an immigrant to this country. He was the first person of his family to come here, he came from a com mun ist country, he knows com mun ism first hand. He did not know one word of eng*glish, except "yes", that's it. He also had less that 100. in his wallet. He did not go on welfare, he took government offered english classes, he took medial jobs to pay rent. He put himself through college without asking for assistance from the gov... he could have as he is a minority. He liked college and all it offered. He lived off campus because he couldn't afford the luxurious lifestyle of living on campus. His transportation were his 2 feet. He did well in college, he learned the language of the land!, he was proud of himself b/c he was independent, he didn't burden his parents with financial support and he didn't burden his government for financial support. Oh, and BTW, through all this, he became a citizen, one of the happiest days of his life.
Today, he is very successful physician with 3 specialties and Board Certified in each... ENT, Allery, and Facial Plastic Surgery. We went on to have 7 children. Our 5 remaining children have been taught to get a good education and do the best you can so you are never dependent on go*vern*ment to dic*tate to you your lot in life.
Stop having babies, speak eng*lish, get an edu*cation, become in*de*pendent so you can live the life YOU want, not the life someone else thinks you should have so you can line their pocketbooks with our t*x do11ars.
And sorry sms, unions ARE part of the downfall of this country, they're big bl00d sukers too, they live off the dimes of others... unions are the inheritance we have from c0mmunist countries.
"...there's always free cheese in the mousetrap..."
Wow! I am really shocked by the attitudes expressed on the boards. In the flesh and blood world people like many of you would not be my friends, so I don't think I care to hang with you in the virtual world.
So did my husband. They left Cu.ba in 1968 and never looked back. He became a citizen and spent 20 years in the mili.tary. He worked hard and earned two masters degrees from Troy University while working full time. He now makes a comfortable living for himself and me. No one in his family ever received government assistance, but rather worked 2-3 jobs to buy their first home after being here only two years. His mother still lives in that same home.
I know young women that are NOT working, have 3-4 kids from 3 different men, never married and are abusing the system. I worked from 16 to 45, never leaving one job until I had another. Parents died young so I couldn't get help from them either. I had no choice but to work.
It's a shame how lazy some young people are in this day and age. My husband's brother has two sons, 25 and 28 still mooching off their Dad. After he paid their way through college they are still living at home. SMH
Whether You Think You Can Or You Think You Can't..... You're Right - Henry Ford
That's certainly your choice Charming... it's exactly attitudes like that this gov* is hoping for and has indoctrinated in you very well... divide and conquer... you've learned it well. I live in the flesh and bl00d world... living with real flesh and real bl00d almost on a daily basis. You, on one hand, want to keep people down, I, on the other, want to give them a step up. When you find it offensive to suggest people educate themselves and support themselves, you need to research yourself as to why.
Well you all can be amazed or distressed or whatever emotion my feeling evokes in you but please remember these are (or rather were) MY feelings.
I'm sure we all react to things in a different way depending on what our circumstances are, who we are as individuals etc.
Remember that this was about 50 years ago. Things were much different then.
I also remember at this same time a man I worked with at the airline that only scheduled people to work 30 hours a week and then made them work 40 (to avoid giving benefits) anyway this man told me I could probably apply for public assistance (cause I thought I could not afford health insurance) and although I did not say anything to him (before you start in on me for this!) I was really insulted and would not have dreamt of doing so.
See posts above from
waverider, Spanish Revival and Zone lady to understand why! It's called personal pride. A very important quality for people to have!
This was a short period of time in my life and I was changing jobs and always for a better one with more **$ and benefits.This message has been edited. Last edited by: lady of shallot,
Personal pride is so lacking these days. In the good old days(I'm only 69) women didn't have children out of wedlock, if they did, it only happened once; that didn't become a way of life for some women and become their only form of financial existence. There are plenty of programs designed to help the uneducated and the uninformed prevent pregnancy. Govt assistance is a joke- what are we on, the 3rd generation of people on welfare, who never knew anyone who did an honest days work for pay. What's wrong with going back to days of WPA where things were built using the unemployed as the laborers, but union rule all but put a stop to that. The breakdown of families is so shameful that I'll not go into that.
I am so sad to see what our society has become. I'm not worried for my self, but for the world my children and grandchildren will have to live in.
mamaspoon, are you on Social Security and Medicare?
As most of us may know, the WPA was one of the country's most successful g.overnment job creation programs; funded by taxpayer dollars as part of FDR's New Deal. It was a way to help reduce public assistance dependency by providing temporary jobs for millions of able-bodied men, women and youth.
At its peak in 1938, the WPA employed 3 million Americans in building public buildings such as courthouses and schools, as well as dams, roads and bridges. Almost every community in the US has at least one WPA funded project.
Criticism came mostly from R.epublican r.epresentatives who did not like FDR or the New Deal. There were some union leaders who did not want WPA workers to be given training, but in 1940, C.ongress allowed for vocational training to make workers available for factory jobs during WWII.
What put an end to WPA in 1943 was an act of C.ongress -- not the unions -- because by that time, unemployment was zero.
I'd love to see a new WPA project; since 2009 the current ad.ministration has called on C.ongress repeatedly for a "modern New Deal program" as a jobs program to fix our ailing infrastructure.
So far, no one has been willing to answer the call.This message has been edited. Last edited by: aychihuahua,
YAY, bravo, aychi!!!!!
Lots of these things really bother me, like the young mother I know who "can't afford" rent but manages to smoke 2 packs a day at $8 a pack.
She also has an expensive smart phone with the whole package internet access, etc.
How about learning to spend your money wisely?
And then there are the people just looking to "do good" for others. Years ago I got called into school (this was about 2nd grade) because my son was not wearing a winter coat. They wanted to know "since I was a single Mother" if I needed help getting him a coat.
I replied rather tersely that he had a perfectly good winter coat at home-he simply wasn't COLD and since he had perfect attendance for the last 2 years, obviously it wasn't his "health" that was the issue!
Of course, if I were like "some" people, I would have taken a coat for him, after all, it was FREE, no one actually PAID for it......
just like everyone is "entitled" to a FREE cell phone.
For sure there are lots of people taking advantage of whatever they can get away with at every economic level!
Good heavens - some folks even take advantage of free internet chat sites to go on about things marginally at best related to the topics of the forum in which they are posting.
Helping to fight Alzheimer's one little quilt at a time. AAQI
This post has really taken off....
I appreciate hearing I am not alone in feeling abused by the hangers-on with fraud of the welfare programs.
I do realize some of you who disagree perhaps were dependent on those recipients being your job security.
Maybe where I live there are a disproprotionate number of slackers who've been awarded disability for the rest of their lives who sure seem to have no trouble jumping out of their SUV's in the H/C stalls at the grocery store and paying with funny looking credit cards ahead of me in line! Or young women with 3 or more kids in tow with no husband or wedding ring in site, just a BFF with as many of her own kids along for the excursion paying the same way. They pile into a nicer, newer vehicle than I'm driving!
It's be nice to believe there truly is a XX month cap on receiving welfare benefits but I don't see that!
And some folks take advantage of those who actively participate in such forums by criticizing their threads with out starting those of their own!
BTW how is "food insecurity" not food related?
Perhaps you could post a thread about proper food topics? Pointing out all the finer points of those "marginally" related!
Now, LOS, let's not get our panties in a bunch!
Half (MOST) of the fun on these boards are the differences in opinions!
Now, for the crankiness that's part of my "charm", we could move over to the Decorating board where I don't reply because "it's garbage" is NOT helpful to OP! And since a lot of my house is "picked", well, enough said!
Good one, Lurah...now those who WORK in social services are also freeloaders.
Want to have a serious, really serious talk about so-called food insecurity and g.overnment assistance to slackers, talk to me about corporate welfare where taxpayers pay billions for agribusiness NOT TO FARM.
Talk to me about billions of taxpayer dollars to agribusiness for crop insurance subsidies.
These are all DIRECT tax dollars spent on corporate welfare, where there are NO eligibilty requirements unlike SNAP and other programs for Americans struggling with poverty.
This is just the beginning...this stuff REALLY chaps my hide. TALK ABOUT ABUSE and gaming the system. It should chap your hide, too. But, it is much easier to blame the poor and the unemployed. Isn't it? The amount of money tax payers spend on corporate welfare dwarfs the amount spent on the poor. Who's kidding whom?
I'm not going to blast you Idaho. You are so correct in your last paragraph.
I worked in a Human Services Department where I had to approve folks for benefits. I had a very weak supervisor who did not want to take complaint calls when people complained about their food stamps decreasing. She would change the records to give them what they wanted. The noisy wheel got got the oil. All workers there member of both politi cal parties complained about this woman. She didn't back her workers.
I cringed when I quite often awarded food stamps to grinning 18 year old woman who were pregnant and unwed. Quite often their food stamp recipient moms were with them. The pair would be happy like it was graduation. I wanted to tell the 18 year old. "No, This isn't the way to improve your life. Get a job. Save money. Better yourself" There should be legislation against so many pregnancies began just to be on the free benefits roster. I have many stories that can't be told here. There is a lot of fraud among recipients. Workers are too busy to monitor them. Government knows this. They don't care. The recipients know this. They abuse it. There are so many ways to fool the system and the workers. Oh by the way. We had, were required to ask if they wanted to register to vote. Workers who belonged to both parties bitterly complained about this. We were terrible overworked. The requirement was a federally mandated policy. These recipients are overwhelmingly members of one party. The government has no budget for these people. Libera l and conservati ve workers both complained about the abuse of the system and the waste of taxpayers money. Still, today the systems and the parks are shut down for people who are working and footing the bill. ..And they won't think of plugging the wide hole through which wel fare drains the li berty from our coun try. Tax payers need to know.
Last Sunday, 60 Minutes did a segment about the fraud that's going on with people collecting disability checks. The numbers cited were staggering.
Hmm. I wonder how their numbers compare to those who cheat on their taxes.
It's a shame the wel fare cheaters don't have an agency as ferocious as the I.R.S checking up on them too. The director in our county would hold staff meetings in which he would brag on the millions of dollars that our county gave away for each time period. We never heard a word about being accurate or careful about our documentations and approvals. He wanted to move up and he did, but the folks in our county were chagrined at his lack of concern for worker's stress level. He was ar rested twice in public bath rooms. The lack of accuracy was not a big concern. Getting records turned in on time 45 or 60 days for different categories was about all that management cared about. Their biggest approval points were earned if we scored well on timeliness. Sad and wrong.
Leafly, I spent the majority of my career in Quality Control, the section of Social Services that evaluates the accuracy of wel fare payments/food stamp allotments/nursing home gpayments. Statistics show that for every dollar misspent, there are three other dollars out there similarly misspent. That is how wel fare error rates are established (although since actual wel fare payments are blockgranted, the feds don't actually track them the same way they do food stamps which is a federal operation even though it is administered by the states.
I know exactly what you mean when you speak about the director in your county. He is running a sweat shop. He has to meet the numbers at the end of each month with not enough staff to do the work. Theoretically you have a choice between quality or quantity, except that federal guidelines mandate case decisions within 30 days, so the "choice" has been made for you. Believe me, the director knows that he is beating a dead horse and it probably keeps him up at night, but short of resigning and messing up his retirement, what is he to do? No doubt your governor is out there telling the public that the state will cut civil service employees without giving up any expectations in service. He tells y'all they will work smart. The director of your county office knows that this is a lie he will have to pretend to believe in front of his staff. You probably won't believe this, but he knows the name of each worker, he knows their strengths and weaknesses, and he feels as much sympathy for each one of them as he can insomuch as he has emotions left.
When I was the assistant director of Quality Control, the director chose to transfer to the county office as manager. She called me a few weeks later and told me that while we in QC wondered how the local offices could make so many obvious mistakes, she now wondered why they weren't making MORE mistakes. The workload is too heavy. It's that simple.
I have been retired for three years now and only recently have I quit having nightmares about the local office where I started and ended my career. I wish I could have stayed on in QC after more than 20 years there, but driving back and forth over 100 miles a day got to be too much for me, so I took a demotion to get back to the office in my hometown, and spent the last year of my career there.
This is an interesting topic. My experience was in he late 50s early 60s. My oldest brother's wife's mother had 5 children my age or younger. She was a lady of the evening and for 6 of her children she received welfare. When her daughters were of an age she send them out to follow in her profession. They became pregnant as quickly as possible to bring money into the home. They had babies as fast as they could for the money and commodities they got, plus the free meals and milk at school. We tried to show sil that there was a better way and life by example and it worked for 12 years then she went off the rails. I do not know whatever became of this family and to be honest I don't care. I, on the other hand, had a job at the public library at the age of 12. I pasted the reviews cut from the jacket and the card pocket in the books. I worked my way up to Asst. Librarian at the age of 16. From 1959 to 2003 I have had a job. The last job being executive secretary in the Mgmt Personnel Dept of a major drug retail chain. But I should also tell you that those people of whom I wrote lived better than our family of hardworking parents. They had new cars and lived in better houses than we did. Their children had scads of new toys and beautiful clothes. They had indoor bathrooms and central heating but never went to high school or had a decent job that I knew of. This being said, I do not begrudge people who really need assistance the ability to get it, but I think everyone should take responsibility for their own lively hood. By the way the state welfare program was abused finally got wise and started paying for only the first five children and requiring sterilization after 5 if you were to continue on their rolls.
Sorry, this is so fragmented but I have been away from this situation for 45 years and was just writing as I thought of things.
Save Planet Earth, it is the only Planet with chocolate!!
pepper, I can assure you that the better housing, new toys and beautiful clothes were paid for by turning tricks, not by welfare grants which are/were pitifully low in most states. I don't think there were ever any states that required sterilization of welfare recipients (although I found evidence that the only doctor in S. Carolina who would deliver welfare babies required sterilization after three pregnancies). Could you provide more info so I could look it up?
BTW, what would such a state do with my mother's first cousin who raised ten children mostly on welfare because her no good husband was forever leaving them? These children were all legitimate, born to a devoutly C atho lic woman for whom birth control and divorce were/are both forbidden. Are her circumstances different from the mother with six illegitimate kids? If so, how? Since determining who is "deserving" is too subjective, isnt it best to concentrate on who is eligible and leave judgments to G*d?This message has been edited. Last edited by: sms29s66,
Thanks for your information. It is interesting.
Our director didn't lift a finger to help his workers in areas where he could have been a help. Many who worked there for much longer than me talked about how he didn't care about his workers. He didn't. I saw it too. --Wouldn't lift a finger in ways that he could have made a big difference. The morale was the lowest in his county compared to all counties in the state. A higher level manager even visited to talk to workers about it. Management in the county was pitifully poor. I had good managers in a different county years ago when I worked in Human Services. We were more thorough and honest back then. The work load was smaller. So, so many mistakes are made now. I wanted to report a fraudulent person when I was a new re-entry worker a few years ago. The woman was doing over the top fraud. My supervisor said 'Oh no that looks okay to me ..." I was still learning then. FRaud reports were complicated for me, so I listened cause I felt I had to at the time. I documented what the woman was doing. Every review after that I documented what was going on. Phony employer, Phony documentation. Phony dwelling. I told all this to my supervisor. She didn't want to do a thing. I wrote in the record that I read her the fraud brochure. Later the fraud investigators got it. They congratulated several of us in different programs. My boss wss over both of them. All I could do was think of the fact that my supervisor didn't deserve any of the credit. She didn't want to be bothered with it. Later the investigator wrote. We want to thank "All" people involved with this. I thought Hmm, They kknow who really did the work. Its a bad bad program. I was able to resign happily. The place could ruin a person's health.
Leafly, I uncovered more than my share of fr*aud cases in the course of 37 years--some that involved the agency itself which was much more infuriating to me than any of the piddling schemes a client may have had. One that was particularly irksome to me was a situation that Fr*aud would not touch with a ten-foot pole because it was so "slithery" that they couldn't tell WHAT the worker was up to even though it had to be something. But the worker upped and quit the minute the case was sampled for QC. That should have told them something. Fortunately, she hadn't been with the agency long enough to have gotten away with much.
And I have to agree with you that there are bad apples everywhere, even at the managerial level. I got an amusing email from a woman I used to supervise who lives in Baton Rouge and keeps in touch with the State Office crowd. They have changed the job duties of one of the wonder boys up there and he is now called Director of Transformation. I had to laugh. That sounds like a department in the Ministry of Magic!!!! And he is no Harry Potter, let me assure you.This message has been edited. Last edited by: sms29s66,
Minister of Transformation, ROTFLOL.
I love it. Just Love it! Our state bought an old outdated computer system from Ohio. For the life of me I can't recall what it was named. OH Gosh, was it ever complicated to use. If one didn't proceed in the correct order the thing would practically light up like a nuclear at tack was in effect and it would proceed to stop. --Exaggerating a little bit there but not much. I guess they have an updated system now. Have a wonderful week SmS!
I think it would be interesting and useful to brainstorm on this situation that Kathy has posted. So what could this young man do to improve his situation?
Off the top of my head I would suggest that when his tax return comes that he put the entire check into the bank every year to use for an emergency fund for things like his abscessed tooth.
I would suggest that he look for a room mate to split the rent on his apartment.
I would suggest that he find an additional source of income. A small side job, marketing some skill he may have such as woodworking, photography, computer assistance, cutting hair, stuffing envelopes, selling on etsy or ebay, cleaning houses, whatever he can muster up.
He is very smart to have no car, cable, or pets. Hopefully he doesn't waste money on smoking, drinking, gambling, or the like.
I would also suggest that he do everything within his power to increase his job skills. He might use his tax return check to pay for classes that would improve his skills. He might talk to his employer about any job skills programs that might increase his usefulness to the supermarket.
In my case, my youngest adult son is working full time, and decided to move back in with us so that he can save his paychecks for tuition as he has decided to do a masters program in business. He has been on this plan for a year, and in another year he will be able to manage tuition without going deeply into debt. He would much rather be on his own, but he is determined to further his education and increase his job skills and his worth to a company.
Anyone else have any ideas on how to make it, and even improve your station on a small salary these days?This message has been edited. Last edited by: cocok,
cocok, being on call with his employer makes it hard to take on a second job. And your suggestion of cutting hair may be against the law since barbers require licenses. When you are not making enough to make ends meet, saving your income tax refund is a luxury that you cannot afford. If he's smart, he doesn't even get a tax refund--he's figured out how much to withhold so that he pays only what he will owe. Why would anyone let the government hold money that is legally their own?
That is a tough situation. I would look for a factory job with benefits even if I had to move.
Leafly, factory jobs with benefits are harder and harder to find these days. Factories have moved overseas and the p olitical powers that be think benefits for mere workers are an imposition on their employers. I happen to agree to a point--I don't know how employers ever let themselves get into the group insurance business, for instance, but since they have, and since switching to a single payor system would put insurance companies out of business, employers are stuck with the system we all have to live by--even the parts of it they don't like.
Factory jobs are still here in America and they have benefits. This is a suggestion for one person on the board. Factories that have moved overseas is old old news. Some companies are starting to move their plants back to the USA. I've heard of several. Still there are more factories here than overseas.
Re distribution of wealth will hurt everyone. A concept pushed in the past 5 years by a person I didn't v o t e for.
In my area within a 2 and 3 hour drive there are plenty of jobs that are factory based. Many are more stable than overnight stocking jobs. Plenty of those type jobs are around. I drive by a place that advertises all the time.
My kids future is being ruined by the powers that be. I grew up in a good factory town. It still is a good factory town. It employed chemists, engineers, electricians. etc. It had a high school that was highly regarded and still is highly regarded. I don't think that the younger generation will have things as easy as I did unless politi cians become more mature, grow some integrity and become less selfish.This message has been edited. Last edited by: Leafly,
Ok. It is easy peasy to point out the negative. What ideas do you have sms29s66, for someone who is having a hard time making ends meet, or who needs to improve their situation? Like say, three ideas.
1. Put money into schools and education rather than warehousing adults in jails.
2. Put money into safe and affordable child care rather than warehousing adults in jails.
3. Pass a living wage law. Today the haves have more than they have at anytime since prior to the Great Depression, and many of us know how well that turned out.
4. Revamp tax laws to close many of the loopholes that allow the super rich to pay low or no taxes.
5. Localities can and should encourage local low income entrepreneurs. Local initiatives can help home bakers, cooks, seamstresses, mechanics, etc. start at home businesses. This will require training of the individuals in health standards for food related businesses and money management techniques; plus, relaxing zoning rules, and new ways of inspecting small businesses.
6. Set aside unused public spaces and help to set up community gardens. As an off shoot of the community gardens - teaching how to cook healthy.
Many of these stand the proverbial snowball's chance in..... because - just look at most of the previous responses to this topic.
Leafly, if factory jobs are making a comeback, that's great news! Are the wages and benefits commensurate with what they once were? (That's a serious question, btw). My brother has been a Ford employee in Kansas City for over 40 years. We had a discussion about concessions the UAW has made concerning wages, etc, some years back, and my brother made a comment that he didn't see how anyone could make it on $12.00/hour. I wondered why it would matter to the "old hands" what the terms were for new hires, and he told me that it concerns him greatly because he has to deal with the screw ups new hires make so he wants them to be as competent as possible. Good wages attract quality applicants.
cocok, if I had all the answers, I'd be running this country. I could point out to you that making unrealistic suggestions doesn't solve specific problems either. It would be best if everyone who needs/wants full time work at livable wages with decent benefits could find work wherever they are, wouldn't it? In an economy where part time jobs are more the norm than in the past , relying onpart time jobs to supplement the already existing part time job might not be doable since everyone else would be trying to do the same. It isn't always possible to have a solution for a particular person's problem. I imagine that the guy whose dilemma we are discussing has already thought of the obvious.
Leafly and Charming, I'm feeling very discouraged right now as to the ability of anyone in our gov ern ment to create a climate conducive to market-based solutions to the jobs problem. The current impasse in D. C. is a new low for this country. We should all be ashamed.This message has been edited. Last edited by: sms29s66,
I'm feeling discouraged too. It isn't the same country that I was born into over 50 years ago.
Want to hear some thing off topic but maybe related. Who gives a flip about the kardashia ns. One can't channel surf or log onto their computer without seeing the disgusting Kris's face. I have to snicker up my sleeve that they are separated. What a horrible tras hy woman. I remember a maid who sang in choir in my home town church. Poor woman had a hard time. She n al co holic husband who died leaving her with four kids. She was good hearted woman but she was silly. Her voice sailed off key above everyone else's in that simple little country church choir but she was happy to sing. Poor woman was a good woman and she worked all her life honestly cleaning toilets at the huge and successful factory in town. I was thinking last night that this honest woman and all the others that were poor just like her are towers and towers above, the Kardashian s and others like them, in character and decency. Guess who gets the attention and phony admiration? The chaff. They are a bunch of clowns--The K's and the senators who become lobbyists when they retire or resign from office. I am worried. I saw first hand how badly government is handling our taxpayer money at the welfare office. People should stand outside of every wel fare office and hold signs. The noisy wheels get the oil.This message has been edited. Last edited by: Leafly,
I was in agreement - including the Kar TRASH ians until your closing statement. We could recoup many times more dollars than the few that are wasted in so called welfare if we cut out corporate welfare. How many of us have seen our local and state govt's hand over tax breaks and give aways to corps to relocated or build in a community and then when the freebies ran out the corp pulls up stakes and moves into another gullible community? How many cities are shaken down by professional ball teams to have the latest and greatest ball park built by tax payers while the owners laugh all the way to the bank. Also, don't forget, the ball parks are usually built on public lands or in low income areas (displacing large numbers of poor people) and the local govt cites eminent domain and steals the land.
Then the biggest tax cheats of all - GE and other large multinational corps. Paying effective corporate tax rates of less than 10% and all the while complaining that it's too much.
Charming, I agree.
The point I am trying to make is that there are "can do" people, and there are "it will never work" people. I am definitely a "can do" person.
My husband and I married at 20 years old. We set off in life without any help from anyone. We have both obtained college degrees without a penny of help from our parents, without student loans, or government programs. He went to school first. We paid for it by me working in a retail shop, him working road maintenance in the summer, and I supplemented our income by babysitting on weekends, and sewing for pay in the evenings. We had little money for food, clothing, etc, but we got by.
After he graduated I went to school, and he worked to pay my tuition and we continued to supplement our income by using whatever skills we had. Even though we had a very limited income we always managed to set a little aside, and when our first baby came along we managed to pay for the bills with cash, as we had no health insurance.
So I have lived the solutions that I have suggested, sms29s66, and I do not find them unrealistic at all.
Our mission in life, in those early years was to do all we could to gain the skills to become valuable employees. We accomplished that. Much of our success is due to a "can do" attitude. I know that sounds corny, but I am living proof.
I also think it is interesting that we seem to have passed our attitude on to our children. I have 4 grown children who have managed to accomplish what my husband and I have. They have all made the sacrifices needed to obtain college degrees and job skills necessary to be able to support themselves and their families. They are all employed, even in this economy, and they are all earning above minimum wage. They all save money for emergencies, and none of them has ever used any kind of government program for assistance. Every single one of them has supplemented their income using life skills. "It might be hard", "It probably wouldn't work", "why should I work that hard", etc are just not part of our thinking.
So pardon me if I have little patience for whiners and complainers who want someone else to figure things out for them. (And I am NOT referring to your son, Kathy_in_wlsv) If you want a better life, then go and make it for yourself. If you want to earn more money, then you have to get yourself the skills that make your work more valuable to someone who might pay for it. It is just the way it is, and no amount of government bashing, or trying to place blame on someone else, or lamenting over your hard case is going to change it.
Unfortunately, the playing field is much more unlevel than when you and your husband started life together. I wish that it were more like it was when I first left high school - but it's not. It is all geared towards helping those succeed who are already halfway up the ladder of success. Then there are sooo many willing and very happy to point fingers at those who start in the basement and cannot climb out.
Some of you probably even think Glenn Beck knows what he is talking about through his crocodile tears and that Bill O'Reilly really had to pull himself up by his own bootstraps.This message has been edited. Last edited by: Charming,
I wrote a huge post about my experiences at the welfare department which was put into evaluation mode.
So I will say, M o r a l s do count. The rest of us who don't have kids out of wed lock should not have to pay for those who do.
At the welfare office, I wanted solid names of employers, Addresses of employers, solid phone numbers, letterheads etc. --solid proof. Guess what. My lou sy supervisor and others like her, made me take half legible notes from unknown managers about immi grants wages. Usually they were hesitant to even sent a note. I had to call them to get the proof and I never got a full name or address. They suddenly didn't speak the language well if I did. I liked some of my imm igrant clients--the sweet service people who promptly brought in their paystubs from hotels etc. Other were very devious with half scribbled notes. Cheating occurred in a major way hrough that method.
A po licy change needed follows:
One out of wedlock baby will get benefits. After that benefits cease if you have another one out of wedlock. Something along those lines. Johnson s c r e w ed us up with his wel fare plan.
The new health plan is made for the irr esponsible types. Those of us who work are going to be driven to pov erty along with the irresponsi ble types. We will be broken by paying for them. I must question the status of leaders who push that. Are they true Americans with liberty for all in their motives. They don't want responsible people around anymore.
This is a foreign concept in our country,
Irresponsible people should lay in the bed that they made, especially when their actions are screwing up things for a whole society.
I don't want a health plan that has their needs placed over my needs.
I've seen the applicant/recipient types at the welfare office.
Welfare families are a totally different culture. They need some mo rals. Oh dear, that's not poli tically correct. Mor als have worked for thousands of years. Even if phon ys use them to be successful they work. Stu pid women have babies out of wed lock and they have too many without a means of support.
Next step in the process:
When the responsible people are broken by paying for the irresponsible people government gets what it wants, and that's not called F R E E D O M.
Government is for the people and by the people.
The majority rules.
Government is doing a sneaky job at changing demographics too of voters. Pushing registration at welfare offices and for immigrants. Wake up A M E R I C A.
Then how is it that my children, all 4 of them, have managed to be just as successful today as my husband and I became all those years ago? They look at the unlevel, job poor, discouraging, unfair, downtrodden economic circumstances of TODAY, and they all decided to do what it takes to be successful, and they have done it. They are all educated, employed, self made people. Does that mean that they will never come up to a struggle? Of course not. Will everything be rosy for them? Of course not. But they have learned to face their struggles and solve their own problems, usually through hard work and more hard work, and quite a bit of self discipline, and more hard work. I still say it is as possible to make it today as it was possible in any other time.
And I don't mean to hold myself or my family up as perfect, or better or smarter. Nor am I meaning to pass judgement on those who are struggling. What my point is, is that most people have the power to make their lives better, if they would just do it. And they might as well get to it, because no one else is going to do it for them; not the government or any well meaning social services employee. And no amount of belly aching is going to change the fact that our lives are up to us to manage.This message has been edited. Last edited by: cocok,
Charming, EVERYONE can succeed with the right attitude! There is help for those who want to help themselves!!
AMEN, Cocok and Georgia Peach.
And I wanted to add this to my impassioned posting:
I do think attitude and hard work have everything to do with success, but I will concede that not everyone has exposure to examples of those principals.
My children are self made and successful, true, and so are my husband and myself. But my parents were also self made and successful, as well as my grandparents, and great grandparents. My great, great grandparents were brave enough to get on a boat from Ireland and strike out in a new land to better themselves, and they did.
In our family culture it is expected that there will be challenges in life, and it is expected that we overcome those challenges. Planning for success, and then putting in the hard work to get there, as a way of life, has come down through the generations, and it is part of who I am and part of what my family is about.
Complaining and whining about circumstances is not tolerated, and is considered a waste of time that would be better put to use getting on with what needs to be done. Going "on the dole" as my parents and grandparents put it was not an option.
So I hope it softens the sting of my comments to say that although my opinions are deep and some might say harsh, or even unrealistic, they have been proven true in my own life, and in the lives of those in my family.This message has been edited. Last edited by: cocok,
There is hardly any need to congratulate those who congratulate themselves. American Exceptualism at its finest.
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