This is OT so stop reading if you don't like such threads.
This had to do with two women I know in their 70's who are really going above and beyond to give help to their daughters in law (and sons) with child care.
The first is a friend who is rarely included in anything to do with her son's young family. The couple can not afford 4 days of week of child care so my friend drives a long distance twice a week to care for her grandchildren for sort of open ended days from early morning. Could be 5 when she is done or nearer 8.
A similar story is being told by my sister whose son's wife just had twins and they have 3 older kids. My sister is babysitting (inc. meals) and doing laundry for all 5 kids but is being refused entry into the home of her son when she delivers the children she has baby sat all day.
My sister thinks it is a sense of entitlement younger people have today (this are both working mothers with very good jobs) but I think it is a lack of setting limits on what one will accept and what one will do.
Any opinions?This message has been edited. Last edited by: lady of shallot,
Aug 11, 2012, 07:20 PM
ga.karen
Yes, I have an opinion and it's not very nice! Both ladies are being taken advantage of and will continue to be unless they stand up for themselves. They need to set limits too! I'm sure they are feeling like they won't be included nor see the grands if they don't do these things...but you have to draw the line some place!
"The soil is the source of life, creativity, culture and real independence." David Ben-Gurion
Aug 11, 2012, 07:28 PM
sleepingbeauty
It is so hard interpreting what happens in other peoples homes. I wish sometimes I was a fly on the wall of other peoples houses to see how the same situation can be represented by everyone so differently.
I do see a sense of entitlement among our young and old. I know when I was a kid I thought that I was "owed" an easy life. I know that the entitlement is not just in the realm of the young. Take my mother-in-law for instance. She cuts lines, lies and cheats because she is owed and kids these days are so disrespectful. When I go shopping with her I spend my time apologizing to the people she offends.
And yes, you are right, ultimately the kids treat their mom's this way because she allows them to.
God Bless, Connie
Aug 11, 2012, 09:43 PM
metwo
It is hard to make much of a judgement since we only know one side of the story.
It is a matter of communication and setting boundaries.
Aug 11, 2012, 09:53 PM
Beau's Rose
Hi Lady,
Wow, these ladies need to stop being available. Let the families re-organize and find other child care.
~Like sands through the hourglass ~So are the days of our lives
Aug 12, 2012, 01:31 AM
Idaho Resident
Wow, LOS, I do like OT threads so glad you posted this one. First thing I would say is that both women need to grow a backbone - oops - guess it's either there or not as you can't just germinate some seeds for it. But, seriously, they both need to reach around their waists and see if they encounter some bony material. I can not believe that anyone who has lived 60-70 years would tolerate such rudeness....
In the first case, the parents should be doing the driving - delivering and picking up - even if that means that the caretaker might have to change her house around to accommodate young children. In the second case, your sister should ask straight out why she isn't being allowed into the home - perhaps the homemaking skills are less than par and they are ashamed of how the home looks?
In either event, I am a firm believer that you teach people how to treat you - if you accept rude behavior, that is what you will get and it will probably get worse over time.
I understand that in both situations, the grandmother is probably thinking that this is the only way she will see her grandchildren - not so. Both of them just need to stand up for themselves and point out how incredibly rude it has been. With a sincere discussion, I bet things will improve (I have more hope for #2 than #1) but I wouldn't put up with it for one more month myself.
Aug 12, 2012, 12:19 PM
lady of shallot
quote:
In either event, I am a firm believer that you teach people how to treat you - if you accept rude behavior, that is what you will get and it will probably get worse over time.
this is what I think too, IR. And to be fair, in my DS's case, she IMHO, can sometimes see a slight where I would not see one. But it is also my opinion that the reason my nephew and his wife moved so close to his parents is because they knew they wanted four children and they knew they would get help from the parents.
Frankly I think my sister and her DH should move. They have a five bdrom house and only one child (single) who does not live in their area so they don't need so many rooms.
My sister is filling in on child care a/c the young people have hired a nanny but she is still doing the laundry which again IMHO the nanny should do.
Aug 13, 2012, 02:22 AM
cocok
I agree that we teach people how to treat us. I also agree that both women seem to be taken advantage of by their children.
On the other hand, the desire to spend time with grandchildren can be great, and they both may be willing to endure less than perfect treatment in order to have that time with the little ones. The relationships they are building must seem to be worth it to them.
Aug 13, 2012, 06:44 AM
Charcoalsmom
Oh, wow, words sort of escape me with this one but I absolutely love that "teach people how to treat us."
Aug 13, 2012, 02:21 PM
aychihuahua
quote:
Originally posted by metwo: It is hard to make much of a judgement since we only know one side of the story.
I agree. And, third hand, at that.
Aug 13, 2012, 07:56 PM
lady of shallot
quote:
agree. And, third hand, at that.
Luckily this is not a court of law so hearsay is allowed!
Aug 14, 2012, 02:44 AM
Idaho Resident
quote:
Originally posted by lady of shallot:
Frankly I think my sister and her DH should move. They have a five bdrom house and only one child (single) who does not live in their area so they don't need so many rooms.
My sister is filling in on child care a/c the young people have hired a nanny but she is still doing the laundry which again IMHO the nanny should do.
Only two thoughts here, LOS. Your sister and her DH may be staying in that big house with hopes of having room for wonderful family times for holidays and other special occasions - and they don't want to give up on that beautiful idea. So, probably the best idea there is to do the old "zipper" thing.
As far as the second thought? If they have a nanny and yet your sister continues to do the laundry? Very easy solution - quit doing the laundry! If they run out of clean clothes or linens or towels, then your nephew or his wife will figure it out and either add those chores to the nanny's job description, hire it out or do without. Think it's time for your sister to take a step back....
Aug 14, 2012, 12:36 PM
lady of shallot
quote:
So, probably the best idea there is to do the old "zipper" thing.
Actually my sister is constantly looking for a new house and also sending me links to them.
They also own a house in the mountains and one at the beach and "escape" to them frequently.
I don't know what the dynamics in your family are like but those "wonderful family" times often backfire and are less than perfect as we found out this summer (this nothing to do with our children but only we five siblings)
Aug 14, 2012, 02:44 PM
aychihuahua
quote:
Originally posted by lady of shallot:
quote:
agree. And, third hand, at that.
Luckily this is not a court of law so hearsay is allowed!
I didn't use the word heresay; you did. The word "heresay" has two definitions; the first is non-legal. Here it is: "Information received from other people that cannot be adequately substantiated; rumor."
The second definition refers to courtroom evidence. Perhaps you are attempting to try this case in the courtroom of public opinion?This message has been edited. Last edited by: aychihuahua,
Aug 15, 2012, 12:03 PM
lady of shallot
quote:
Perhaps you are attempting to try this case in the courtroom of public opinion?
No, actually Aychihuahua I was just relating stories that I thought were of human interest. I was not trying at all to start any kind of controversy.
Also according to the definition you source as non-legal. . . "Information received from other people that cannot be adequately substantiated; rumor." The word I used is incorrect.
Since the information I relayed (baby sitting) etc can of course be adequately substantiated.
I actually within the past hour heard another story of invasive/intrusive, total lack of regard of another person's time and space, behavior; but of course I will not cite it here as the "injured" party may simply have been overreacting and the "injurer" probably has a very valid "side of the story"
Aug 29, 2012, 12:58 PM
Holly in South Jersey
This is an interesting thread. As a grandparent, I love my grandchildren, but have no desire to watch them on a regular basis. I know lots (too many) grandparents who have retired and now can't do anything they planned to do because of babysitting.
I like the quote about people treating you how you let them- sounds very Dr. Phil. In the case of both grandparents, are they at least getting paid? If not, my sincere opinion is that they are nuts.
People we know watch their grandchildren (they do get paid) because they don't want them to go to daycare. But these retired people are now totally tied down, and "can't" even go on vacation!
In the case of both grandparents, are they at least getting paid? If not, my sincere opinion is that they are nuts.
No absolutely no pay involved. In the first case the grandparents were left in the hot seat when young couple moved near them and then started having babies. Since it would not occur to a baby sitting Dad to take a kid with him to a gas station or other type errand like that (like his own mother did with her young children) he just dropped the kid then kids off with his retired parents.
In the second case the grandmother was so hopeful of being in her grandchildren's lives that she just agreed to the 2X weekly long days of child care (in this case the reason the young people want her is to save on day care expenses.)
Aug 29, 2012, 04:34 PM
sms29s66
The word is spelled "hearsay" and if you think about it, it makes more sense that way.
Setting boundaries can be mighty tricky. My mother's cousin was denied access to her only two grandchildren until they were adults. Her sin? She announced to her pregnant daughter-in-law that she was not a built in babysitter. She regretted the consequences ever after, but I wonder if she ever really understood her faux pas. Some people really can't see their own flaws....This message has been edited. Last edited by: sms29s66,
Aug 29, 2012, 04:51 PM
lady of shallot
quote:
y. My mother's cousin was denied access to her only two grandchildren until they were adults. Her sin? She announced to her pregnant daughter-in-law that she was not a built in babysitter.
while your cousin's remark may have been jumping the gun a little it hardly seems to have merited the response of your cousin's wife. That seems extreme in the extreme! But then you have to wonder where was the woman's son in all this? He was happy with his children having no relationship with his own mother?
Aug 29, 2012, 05:09 PM
sms29s66
los, naturally the only side of this situatioh that we ever heard was our cousin's. I know she never liked her DIL, even before this happened. Obviously the DIL didn't care for her at all. And as for the son, he is a complete wuss. We suspect that his wife had her lover living with them....
Aug 31, 2012, 07:42 PM
lady of shallot
quote:
We suspect that his wife had her lover living with them....
back in 1970 I had a temp job taking the census. I saw many interesting living configurations that I would have been unaware of . . . in some cases there was an extra male in the household but I don't think in those cases that it was the lover of the wife!
Aug 31, 2012, 09:58 PM
sms29s66
los, after a 37-year career with Social Services, I doubt that there are ANY household configurations I haven't seen.
Sep 01, 2012, 10:44 AM
lady of shallot
SMS we just had a very sad case here in Maine, which will involve social services.
For some reason a mother had left a 3 mo old and & 2yr old with a co-worker for the night. Seemingly so the 10 year old daughter of the sitter would be appeased for another happening. During the night the 10 year old killed the baby.
Tragic and a dilemma for all agencies involved. But not as bad as the case some years ago when it was a social worker herself who killed a child!
Sep 01, 2012, 12:11 PM
flboy
We always want to help our children but in the end someone will be hurt in the regards to every day day care, babysitting etc. I too know this well. The child needs to be around other children. If the parents can afford to work then the child should go to day care after school and when they become scool age. Grandparents and parents are too many people for a child to comprehend.They get confused and sometimes resent the grandparents who of course have another set of rules for raising children. When the child is young and before school age the grandparents are a very good safe choice. They will be taken advantage of because the working parents today are stretched to the limit. I also minded my GD for 12 years so I know a bit about the heart break that will come.
html
Sep 02, 2012, 10:44 AM
flboy
quote:
Originally posted by flboy: We always want to help our children but in the end someone will be hurt in the regards to every day day care, babysitting etc. I too know this well. The child needs to be around other children. If the parents can afford to work then the child should go to day care after school and when they become school age. Grandparents and parents are too many people for a child to comprehend.They get confused and sometimes resent the grandparents who of course have another set of rules for raising children. When the child is young and before school age the grandparents are a very good safe choice. They will be taken advantage of because the working parents today are stretched to the limit. I also minded my GD for 12 years so I know a bit about the heart break that will come.
html
Oct 15, 2012, 01:12 PM
trish212
So many stories....
We were blessed as kids to have a dear neighbor watch us in the mornings as our father and mother headed off to work. She knew how to draw lines and we loved her for it. She had tried helping Mom by putting dishes in the dishwasher for her. Mom would come home and complain they weren't done correctly. As kids...we shared it with our dear neighbor. She told our mother..."If you don't like how I do it, I can leave them in the sink for you." Mom stopped complaining. We always saw her as a confident woman after telling our mother this. It's important to say these things. And...it's also important to be open in hearing them. Many lessons to be learned.
I can only learn from the lessons that are my own. It's important to be enlightened to the truth.
Oct 15, 2012, 08:17 PM
16paws
It's important to establish boundaries and not let others treat you like a floormat. If you don't speak up, you will be run over by many people who are looking to save money or just can't be bothered to tend to their own children. You don't have to be obnoxious or cruel just tell them firmly that you have things to do and you can help but not be a primary care provider.
